It Depends: Lessons in Technology Leadership

Spotify Technology Career Steps

In this episode of "It Depends: Lessons in Technology Leadership," host Kevin Goldsmith discusses Chapter 33 of his book, which details the career framework he helped develop at Spotify. Kevin emphasizes that a career pathing framework is the most critical document for engineering leaders. It serves as the backbone of organizational culture by reinforcing desired behaviors through promotion and performance management.

Kevin explains how the Spotify framework was carefully designed to:

• Emphasize team over individual contribution (reflecting Swedish vs. American cultural differences)
• Focus on behaviors and professional maturity rather than achievements
• Define spheres of impact that expand with seniority
• Align individual success with company success
• Provide flexibility in career choices

He describes the careful considerations that went into creating the framework, including being conservative with the number of levels and keeping step designations private to avoid embarrassing employees. Kevin also shares personal experiences from Microsoft that influenced his approach.

This episode is part of a trio on career pathing, with the next episode covering lessons learned from implementing the framework.

• Listener Survey: https://forms.gle/JVeKHsHJKhEM3dvK6
• The book: It Depends: Writing on Technology 2012-2022
• Your host: Kevin Goldsmith
• This chapter in the newsletter: https://kevingoldsmith.substack.com/p/spotify-technology-career-steps

Building a technical career path at Spotify

In this episode of the "It Depends" podcast, host Kevin Goldsmith shares his unique experience designing Spotify's engineering career framework. As the leader of this initiative, Kevin provides a behind-the-scenes look at how Spotify's distinct career pathing system was developed, a system that reinforced its unique engineering culture rather than undermining it.

Kevin explains the delicate balance of timing when implementing a career framework. Waiting too long (as Spotify did) can cause problems, but implementing too early can stifle a growing organization. He emphasizes how career pathing must align with company values, as it directly influences what behaviors get rewarded and ultimately shapes your culture.

The episode covers Spotify's collaborative approach to creating its "Career Steps" framework, involving representatives from across the organization rather than simply adopting another company's model. Kevin shares their guiding principles, including the crucial shift from focusing on achievements to behaviors, supporting specialists and generalists, and defining career growth by expanding spheres of influence.
Whether you're a tech leader contemplating how to structure growth paths for your team or an individual contributor wondering how career frameworks influence company culture, this episode is a must-listen. It offers valuable insights into one of the most foundational aspects of engineering leadership, insights that are relevant and beneficial for both roles.

• Listener Survey: https://forms.gle/JVeKHsHJKhEM3dvK6
• The book: It Depends: Writing on Technology 2012-2022
• Your host: Kevin Goldsmith
• This chapter in the newsletter: https://kevingoldsmith.substack.com/p/building-a-technical-career-path
• ELC Seattle meetup: https://elc.community/home/clubs/seattle-kcr/events/elc-x-airbnb-seattle-meetup-7oxyok5u0d

Changing Hiring Practices to Build a More Diverse Technology Organization

Are your hiring practices unintentionally limiting diversity in your organization? In this episode of It Depends host Kevin Goldsmith explores the critical changes that can help technology companies build more inclusive and high-performing teams. Drawing on his experience scaling engineering teams, Kevin challenges conventional hiring biases—such as prioritizing certain universities or requiring excessive pre-interview work—and offers actionable steps to reduce bias in the hiring process.

If you're a tech leader, hiring manager, or aspiring executive, this episode is packed with insights on creating a fairer, more equitable hiring pipeline—without lowering the bar. Tune in to learn how intentional changes can lead to stronger, more diverse teams, benefiting your company and the industry.

• Listener Survey: https://forms.gle/JVeKHsHJKhEM3dvK6
• The book: It Depends: Writing on Technology 2012-2022
• Your host: Kevin Goldsmith
• This chapter in the newsletter: https://kevingoldsmith.substack.com/p/changing-hiring-practices-to-build

A diversity challenge: tech start-ups have a great opportunity

As major tech companies retreat from their commitments to diversity, equity, and inclusion, startups can lead the way. In this episode, Kevin Goldsmith explores why diverse teams consistently build better products and create stronger, more effective workplaces. He reflects on personal experiences in leadership, shares insights on how startups can leverage the "law of small numbers" to make a meaningful impact, and explains why prioritizing diversity isn't just the right thing to do—it’s also smart business.

Tune in to hear why building an inclusive team can be a competitive advantage and get a preview of the next episode’s discussion on practical strategies for hiring a diverse tech team.

• Listener Survey: https://forms.gle/JVeKHsHJKhEM3dvK6
• The book: It Depends: Writing on Technology 2012-2022
• Your host: Kevin Goldsmith
• This chapter in the newsletter: https://kevingoldsmith.substack.com/p/a-diversity-challenge-tech-start

Building a Management Training Curriculum at Avvo

In Episode 27 of It Depends: Lessons in Technology Leadership, Kevin Goldsmith explores the process of creating a management training curriculum at Avvo. Reflecting on his journey as a manager and lessons learned from his early days at Microsoft and Adobe, Kevin highlights the importance of intentional training for engineering managers. This episode delves into the innovative approach used at Avvo, including collaborative exercises to identify training priorities and designing tailored development programs to support technology leaders.

Discover actionable insights on fostering a strong management culture, balancing technical and managerial responsibilities, and creating effective learning experiences for teams. Whether you're an aspiring manager, an experienced leader, or part of a team looking to improve, this episode offers practical guidance and inspiration. Tune in to learn how to build a management training framework that elevates your organization!

• Listener Survey: https://forms.gle/JVeKHsHJKhEM3dvK6
• The book: It Depends: Writing on Technology 2012-2022
• Your host: Kevin Goldsmith
• This chapter in the newsletter: https://kevingoldsmith.substack.com/p/building-a-management-training-curriculum

Using Self-Selection to Create Journey Teams at Avvo

In this insightful episode of The It Depends Podcast, host Kevin Goldsmith, seasoned CTO and author, takes listeners behind the scenes of his first CTO role at Avvo, a legal tech company. Kevin shares his real-world experience in transforming the organizational structure by introducing journey teams—an innovative approach influenced by, but distinct from, Spotify’s model. He discusses the challenges of managing small teams, the necessity of fostering team autonomy while maintaining accountability, and the crucial role of leadership in balancing top-down constraints with bottom-up ownership.

Kevin dives into the process of moving from a traditional hierarchy to a matrix organization and ultimately to journey teams. He explains how self-selection played a key role in empowering teams, fostering engagement, and driving sustainable growth in a fast-scaling company. Listeners will gain practical insights into building adaptable organizational structures tailored to company culture, evolving leadership styles, and scaling strategies for tech teams.

If you’re a technology leader navigating team scaling, culture transformation, or thinking of adopting self-selection and journey teams in your organization, this episode is packed with actionable takeaways.

• Listener Survey: https://forms.gle/JVeKHsHJKhEM3dvK6
• The book: It Depends: Writing on Technology 2012-2022
• Your host: Kevin Goldsmith
• This chapter in the newsletter: https://kevingoldsmith.substack.com/p/using-self-selection-to-create-journey

 

 

Thoughts on emulating Spotify’s matrix organization in other companies

In this episode of It Depends, host Kevin Goldsmith, a seasoned technology leader and CTO, explores the intricacies of Spotify's famed matrix organization model and its applicability to other companies. Drawing from his firsthand experiences at Spotify during its formative years, Kevin delves into the successes and challenges of implementing the Spotify model, addressing common misconceptions and the cultural nuances that influence its effectiveness.

Kevin recounts how the model's flexibility and autonomy transformed team dynamics and how its structure has been adapted (or misapplied) by other companies. He also discusses how the U.S. workplace culture, rooted in individualism, impacted the adoption of Spotify’s collaborative team-oriented practices. The episode is filled with insights on organizational scaling, the benefits of full-stack teams, and the pivotal role of company-specific cultural alignment in applying the model.

• Listener Survey: https://forms.gle/JVeKHsHJKhEM3dvK6
• The book: It Depends: Writing on Technology 2012-2022
• Your host: Kevin Goldsmith
• Interviews with Kevin (about the Spotify model and other things): https://www.kevingoldsmith.com/resume.html#interviews
• For your start of year planning: The Personal Strategy Off-site, Own your Calendar
• The newsletter issue with the text of this chapter: https://kevingoldsmith.substack.com/p/thoughts-on-emulating-spotifys-matrix
• The Spotify Model Whitepaper: https://blog.crisp.se/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/SpotifyScaling.pdf

The Spotify model: how to create, dissolve, and remix teams to be more dynamic and more innovative

In this episode of It Depends, host Kevin Goldsmith dives into Chapter 26 of his book It Depends: Writing on Technology Leadership 2012–2022. Kevin shares his firsthand experiences with the Spotify model—a revolutionary approach to team organization designed to foster agility, innovation, and collaboration.

Drawing on his years at Spotify, Kevin explains how the model allows teams to dynamically form, dissolve, and remix based on company needs. He also addresses some common misconceptions about its application and reflects on lessons learned from the Spotify model and how to adapt its principles to other organizations.

Don’t forget to subscribe to the accompanying newsletter and share your thoughts via the linked listener survey to help shape the future of the podcast!

Links to things mentioned in the podcast:

• Listener Survey: https://forms.gle/JVeKHsHJKhEM3dvK6
• The book: It Depends: Writing on Technology 2012-2022
• Your host: Kevin Goldsmith
• The newsletter issue with the text of this chapter: https://kevingoldsmith.substack.com/p/the-spotify-model
• The Spotify Model Whitepaper: https://blog.crisp.se/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/SpotifyScaling.pdf
• The Spotify Model videos: https://blog.crisp.se/2014/03/27/henrikkniberg/spotify-engineering-culture-part-1
• Spotify Q3 2024 Numbers (640 MAU): https://variety.com/2024/digital/news/spotify-q3-2024-earnings-premium-subscribers-1236207771/